hey! what is it that you're philosophizing with lingwei
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
she makes it sound so interesting
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well
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i'm breaking all her premises
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
huh
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
wat's her premises?
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like about our tendencies to catagorise and differentiate things
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the whole summary is that nothing is different or same
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but in degrees of gradient
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
huh why not
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
err yeah nothing is completely the same what
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
it's just similar
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ah ha!
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correct
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ur faster than her understanding
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but that's talking about science and physical matter
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i'm talking about human tendencies
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of intepretating the world
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but u can have things that are mathematically the same
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
e.g.?
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well maths is a logic system that we work on to understand our environment
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
yeah
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so is like science and literature and blah blah
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the question is
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is logic not logical?
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hmm
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
i think u mean is logic to be trusted
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
human logic
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
well
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well something like that
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
i think if u throw logic out of the window
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
then all you have left is what
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
faith
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hha
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
haha
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ah ha!
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
which is religious
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correct
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faith is another way to understand the world
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so is feeling
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
yeah
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but what is feeling
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all these stem from
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
u can say that feeling is observation by senses right
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
which is what science is based on
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me questioning her about surrealism
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
surrealism?
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hmm, science is only the physical part of feeling
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i'm talking about the emotional part
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
ohhh
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hmm
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well
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she was saying that
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
i always think that
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
emotional is an internal process
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and then?
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hmm not sure
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=_=
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
so what was lingwei saying
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anticlimax
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
haha no i dont even know what my point is
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well emotions can be a common process
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i mean mutual
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or communal
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
how?
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emotions can be a tool to understand the world by feeling it
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its like sometimes
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but then ah
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when u read a book
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u gain more from feeling it than understanding it
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that is what i was trying to tell lingwei
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hmm
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coz she totally dun understand murakami
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coz of the content
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well, that is surrealist literature
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
ohhh ok i think i understand wat u're saying
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but i explain to understand the book, the best way is to feel it
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
it's like dadaism also
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
no point trying to understand it
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but just to experience the effect of it
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correct
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coz understanding
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trying to make sense
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is a human system
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which may be a fallacy
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and base on that fallacy
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hmm but i think when you feel emotions
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
you're creating some kind of sense out of it also
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we try to make arguments, supporting our dissertations with specifics and examples
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
that makes you react in a certain way
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hmm, not entirely true (this is the 2nd level)
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so what if u feel sad?
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or so what if u feel happy
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is there a need to make sense out of it?
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but your brain organised it in a certain way
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correct!!!!
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
to make u react this way
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
only that u can't understand it in logical terms
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i'm saying thats how human work
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which may not be the truth of how the real things work
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but then i think there are people who try to dissect it even further
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
and try to make sense of emotion'
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
like why do we feel happy
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i'm asking her
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
it's a reward impulse
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why do we need to make sense of anything
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hmm
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
we make sense of things to identify patterns
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coz that is what i mean by attempting to impose a logic
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
and we identify patterns to inform us of the consequence of decisions
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
like if you know what makes you happy
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
you can create situations so that u can be happy
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
you don't have to make sense of why you are happy
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but you can make sense of the type of thing that makes you happy
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hmm, but u see, this is tainted by human intepretations which may not be what our universe really work
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take a rock for example
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it does not matter to a rock that it is happy or sad
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or is it a consequence or is it part of a pattern.
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it is just there
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
yeah
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nor is it there for a reason
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but like Descartes said
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
everything is like shadows or images
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
u can't really see the real objects that are there or whether they are there
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
the most is you can make out the patterns of the shadows
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
and react to them
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well i'm questioning the whole basis of making meaning and having reactions
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coz as i told lingwei
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the whole problem of literature or the arts is trying to make meaning
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which is first a human construct, which is second may not be the truth, which is third, does it matter?
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
i think yeah
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
it's not the truth
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but yes
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
it does matter
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
for example Newton's laws are not accurate representations of truth
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
they can only represent physics at a certain scale with a certain limitation to gravity
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but you can still engineer things based on his laws
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
on this earth
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
when it comes to outer space or nano scales
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
you need quantum physics
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
so it's not the truth
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but it's a pattern
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
and it does matter
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hmm
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perhaps the question is
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why do things matter
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hmm
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why do understanding newtons law matter
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or quantum theory matter
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hmm
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i think
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
i think as organisms
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
we understand things
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
to survive
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this discussion may lead to even fundamental questions liek
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
if you're a rabbit and you understand wat is a fox
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why are we on earth
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
you can run away from it
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
errr ok that is an unanswered question
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correct
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
if you're religious
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
just say god made you
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
haha
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lol
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u see
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actually
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in my opinion
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but i think we only exist as patterns as well
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not whether it is correct or not
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
i'm just an arrangement of particles that is self-sustaining
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all argument or questions lead to the fundamental question of our existene
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
and does self-sustaining things
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
yeah
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
they do
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
so yeah
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
i tend to believe i just exist as a pattern la
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lol
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my question is why is there a need to exist
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
oh
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
there is no 'need'
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
it just happens
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good one
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
'need' is another human construct
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correct
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and if u apply what u reply
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u can just answer everything in the world
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which is what i'm trying to tell lingwei
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like why do we have to make meaning?
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oh, it just happens
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
it happens
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can u get the depth of this answer
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but i don't believe in predestined things
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
as in
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
it's not a matter of cause and effect
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
it's more of some kind of chance
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correct
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i think chance is a good way to say it just happens
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i can this the making meaning and the it just happens the answer to the question to existence
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i mean i call this
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
haha but then, as a self-sustaining pattern, my nature is to try and identify patterns and meanings
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i know
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thats what we do
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
ya
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i was trying to explain the other way to lingwei
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the it does not matter, the it just happen thingy
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
haha k
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coz she was totally head into the making meaning thing
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
ohhhh
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and she does not see the possibility of it just happens
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
k
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
i get it
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lol
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now u can enlighten her
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
aiyah it's just different points of view la
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correct
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but it's important to acknowledge valid points of view also
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well, i'm not saying that its wrong
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to make meaning
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i'm just letting her know, that there is another option
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coz making meaning i think has caused to much trouble for us
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
why?
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well my dissertation has something to do with that
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coz as we make meaning
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
oh ok
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we tend to shift things to different gradients
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
oh i thought u're doing the technology track one?
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specialize things
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yah
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i'm trying to unspecialise things
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
on constructed wetlands or sumthing?
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my dissertation is only a method of addressing part of the unspecialization process
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i'm dealing with integrating ecology, with social, economic systems
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
oh ok
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not wetlands
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anyway, i think
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
wow but isn;t that quite a broad topic?
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
as in for a dissertation
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we are moving into the whole unspecialization process
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correct
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death of me
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
haha k
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so maybe i'm focusing more
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
it seems tough to even cover that in 10K words la
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so more people are doing parts
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then maybe there is only one knowledge
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no more science, religion, literature etc
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but isn't that a Renaissance concept
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in the future. its just sad that i can't live to see that day
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dun think its their concept
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
like breaking the boundaries between all these disciplines
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they started with it
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but we specialise to be more efficient
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
yeah but there's always a need to break it into smaller parts
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now we are putting things together
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
ok
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
i think the closest we have come to finding this unifying thing
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
lies in the Higgs boson thing
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i really want to know how lingwei will make out of our conversation, we are such polar ends
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higgs boson thing?
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
yeah they recently made this huge Large Hadron Collider thing
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lol
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
which is a 8 km long particle collider
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u read da vinci code
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ur talking about string theory?
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
in an attempt to discover this Standard particle
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i mean angels and demons
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
which will tell us about everything that exists
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u know
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
oh i haven't read/watched tat
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i took this module in physics in uni
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
ya
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and the latest finding or somewhat latest that i know
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
i mean what u're talking about is Unifying Theory
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is that the smallest conituent is spiritual energy
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unified_field_theory
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so this brings us closest to the unified field theory
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so my problem is
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we tend to see things as this is religion and this is science or this is blah blah
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
yeah
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and fail to understand that all are one
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hmm but not really leh
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coz we are inadequate to make sense of them now
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
science and religion already contradicts
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
so they cannot be one
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i think
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contradictions
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is a human construct
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as we specialise
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we try to make them different
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so that they can be easier specialised
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its like when we study
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we try to identify differences in patterns
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so that we can better understand
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then try to call them styles, or periods, or states
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then we go further with christian, with islam, with buddhism
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
hmm but then u must think that
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even within each specifics, we break up into more specifics to understand further
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
the whole reason why we have so many ways of understanding the world
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
is because we are physically limited to a site and a way of seeing it
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correct
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
and the only useful way to understand this site
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
is to come up with a set of rules that help us understand this site
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
whether or not these rules apply in another country, another continent, another planet, another galaxy
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
we don't care
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so is not that since we are physically limited we cannot assume that it is the truth?
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the problem is that we are assuming that things are wrong or right
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which may not be the truth?
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
well
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
then i can also ask
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
why are you putting such a high value on truth?
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ahahha
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
cos truth is the most difficult and useless thing
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that boils back to my answer of the value of meaning and the value of chance
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but u're asking for a unifying theory right
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i think
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
so wat's the value of finding this
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the unified theory is only an extension of the value of meaning path
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thats my answer to that path
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my other inclination is the value of chance
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i think our language is insufficient to express what i want to say
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btw, can i put this on my blog
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
haha yeah u have to reject language too
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i find it utterly interesting
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
yeah me too
Qibao currently has an inverted Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs says:
but i think u definitely have to read what other people write about this also
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correct